Electrolite/Catalyst

[hydrotinkerer]

I noticed alot of different electrolite/catalyst are being used. I would like to know what you are using and why you made that choice. Please include the types you like and don't like. I have been using Naoh(sodium hydroxide) for 6 months now and have not had a problem. It is the only catalyst I have used so I have nothing to compare to. So if there is something better I'm all ears. All my gens are now dry cells now so I can run anything I want and I don't worry about heat.

[candyman55]

I have tried several NOAH, KOH, Citric Acid, Vinegar, and am now going to try Methanol as soon as I finish reassembling my generator. So far KOH is the winner. But I have really high hopes for Methanol.

[hydrotinkerer]

Candyman was the amp draw the same on all of the catalyst you tried? If so was the gas production rates so different?

[Bob]

I've tried Salt,Baking soda,KOH,Lemonaid,Vinegar, and stright water....
for me Lemonaid is what I keep comeing back to... the KOH seams to coat the cell and render it useless if the KOH turns Coffee brown (which it has been doing lately with running the cells in parallel, more heat I guess.)
so far I think Lemonaid works just as good as KOH without the bad points of KOH... so thats why I use lemonaid Koolaid (un sweetened).
...
vinegar turned coffee brown and lost amprage draw and was hard to get enough amp draw with it.
bakeing soda made tons of Green GOO ... coated the plates and output practically quit.
salt was the same as Baking soda.
stright water works but I wanted more amp draw than 5 amps ! <GRIN>
...
Koh is good... as long as it don't turn colors on you...I used it for months with no problem it stayed clear, only had a slight foam problem at times... but with more heat it will burn and turn to dark coffee color and when it does that get it out of the cell fast, as it will cook onto the plates and you have to clean it with Muratic acid to get it clean then.
...
I have seen the Koolaid foam a few times just after installing it... but the problem seams to go away
with use.... no burning no discoloration, stays clean but is hard to ge High amp draw with it...takes many packs to get to 15 amps cold 30amps hot....
and it will freeze !...
....
Bob............

[Too Many Secrets]

BS or salt is a big NO. Don't use it on anything larger then paperclips and paper-cup. KOH, NOAH or KoolAid is good. Frankly I'm not thrilled working with Lye. KoolAid has worked for me, with great results and I don't need to 'space suit up' just to add a bit to my cell. I also don't have to worry about the possibility of lye mixing with my aluminum engine parts.

[hydrotinkerer]

Bob, Using 15amp cold on Koh and koolaid is the gas production about the same? Do you have a lpm measure for both? In my type gens I'm not worried about any heat problems. Does the foam from koolaid go away on its own or do you have to flush it out?

Secrets, Have you had a foaming problem with koolaid? Do you have a lpm on paper clips and cup?

I went to the store looking for citric acid. I found some in the canning area. I took the stuff home put it in my gen and it worked great. Atleast for 30min. After 30min it stopped producing and the stuff got really thick. I told my wife about it and she started reading the box. Here it comes: The stuff I bought was called "Sure Gell" it for making jelly. Guess what I had a gen full of? JELLY . You talk about a pain to clean out, it took forever. You guys needed a good laugh. I can tell you that stuff doesn't work.

[randy]

jello, ya never told me that one, now that's funny there, musta been a real pain to clean out.

[geezer]

Candyman...careful with methanol there are lots of plastics that it will destroy. it will eat up plastic in line fuel filters.

[Too Many Secrets]

Bob, Using 15amp cold on Koh and koolaid is the gas production about the same? Do you have a lpm measure for both? In my type gens I'm not worried about any heat problems. Does the foam from koolaid go away on its own or do you have to flush it out?

Secrets, Have you had a foaming problem with koolaid? Do you have a lpm on paper clips and cup?

I went to the store looking for citric acid. I found some in the canning area. I took the stuff home put it in my gen and it worked great. Atleast for 30min. After 30min it stopped producing and the stuff got really thick. I told my wife about it and she started reading the box. Here it comes: The stuff I bought was called "Sure Gell" it for making jelly. Guess what I had a gen full of? JELLY . You talk about a pain to clean out, it took forever. You guys needed a good laugh. I can tell you that stuff doesn't work.

No foaming from the KoolAid here.

As for the paper cups, they work great, light weight, expandable, HOWEVER they are tough to get a good seal on so no lpm results as of yet...

[Bob]

If I remember correctly the LPM from both KOH and Kolaid was right at 1lpm for both at 15ampsofcorse thats not a very good output for 3 cells so I messed with it till I got 2LPM by removeing one of the 3 cells... that helped a bunch... eather KOH or Koolaid seams to produce the same actually... foaming does go away without any intervention at all.... dunno why....
....
I looked in to the hydroxy cell tonight as I checked the oil on the truck and the Koolaid is light brown
.... I gott'a have something rusting in there causeing the color change in the electrolite
but I don't know what it is...... I guess I'll have to tear it completely down to find it and use only what a magnet won't pick up !!!!!!
...
sense the wife is having to drive the truck again while I wait for wheel berrings for her car
the cell will get no use at all, so I might take it off and turn the bypass valve off !
...the truck seamed to have problems starting tonight , it was very cold, ice on the windshield and all that... about 1/4" of hail on the ground from yesterday still, so its not melting much ( had 3")
I'm thinking its time to pull the cell till warmer weather hits sense I have yet to come up with a Antifreeze.... the Koolaid was not frozen though so thats a good sign... I have no idea why not , it should have been !...
...
Bob.........

[hydrotinkerer]

I ordered Koh today from AAA chemical. I also picked up some koolaid and I still have my Naoh. I'm all set to see which one I like best.

[candyman55]

Candyman was the amp draw the same on all of the catalyst you tried? If so was the gas production rates so different?

I really didn't try all of the electrolytes at the same time nor did I use them all in the same electrolizer, but KOH seemed to acccelerate the production and maintain the amperage better than all of the rest. I think that most of the problems with KOH started when I increased the amperage above 30 and increased the temps above the 100 deg. mark.

[Manta]

Candyman55,
I don't know if you have used methanol before,  maybe from the bio fuel scene, But I have to point out that methanol is a very dangerous substance if you are not careful. It is a neurotoxin and can blind you and can kill you if you absorb too much of it. It is absorbed through the skin. It also boils at 64 C (147 F) and the vapour is very explosive.

The mixture of methanol,  hydrogen and oxygen seems dodgy indeed.

Having said all that,  I have used it for years to make bio diesel and have come to no harm. In fact I quite like the extra head that appeared back in 2000 (joking).

So,  I wouldn't use it in a heat generating device.  And never,  ever,  breath in the fumes.

Take care.

Manta

[candyman55]

I agree, Methanol is dangerous but. I will only use it mixed with water probably somewhere around 30% meth and 60% water. At that concenteration the boiling poing will be much higher than 64C the bi product will be H2,CO2 and Oxygen.

I think in a diluted concentration we may be able to realize the benefits of the mixture not freezing plus lower the voltage requirements to electrolize the mixture.

this is interesting reading:
http://www.techbriefs.com/content/view/1828/34/

[hydrotinkerer]

After reading the tech brief I am curious as to how well it will work. Where are you going to get pure methanol.