100% Hydroxy powered Pickup!

[Bob]

 The title says it, that is what I plan to do !
In my head I think I have all the kinks and problems worked out, or at least have 2 or 3 alternitives for every one that may arise!
...
the Truck will be my 1995 Toyota 2WD 5spd Trans R-22 Fuel injected pickup truck
 I have had hydroxy generators on and off this truck for a few years now
my modifications include timing adjust,Mass air flow adjustment to 2 clicks on the lean side.
a "Tent-pole Condom" over the Oxygen sensor to seal it off from the exhaust gas but still leave it in the heat of the exhaust... and a "Matt Valve" that is a garden hose and inline valve that simply goes around the Mass air flow sensor, so more air can go by the sensor than it knows about and this allows me to lean out the gas very easily.
... other than that right now I have the standard Hydroxy generator of "IN A DIP" style, a long bubbler, a 300amp continuious duity Relay to turn it on and off with,a 40 or 50 amp circuit breaker in line with the cell, and a lighted toggle switch on the drivers side dash to turn on or off the cell. (this switch throws the large 300amp relay)
...
 the cell I'm running at the moment is an Old "Randy cell MKI"...(With the shimstock)
seams to be working well after being used for about 8 months and then cleaned and then removed and thrown in the shed for about 2 years... now its back in action and working fine
... I'm Running Lemonade Koolaid as the electrolyte... I have given up on KOH as it gets dirty too easy and coats the plates lowering production...
....
  So My plan is to make at least 8 cells (similar to the one I am using now).... put them each in their own container., Mount them on a rack to fit in the back of the pickup, along with their own bubbler.
 I plan to feed at least 2 bubblers from the 8 cells , I may need more bubblers I don't know yet, I'll feed the bubblers with 1/4" line from each cell but take 1/2" line from the bubbler to the intake manifold just infront of the throttle body... I will probably have a water trap in that line before the intake manifold.
... I'll have to invest in a 300amp altenator fairly soon if i am to get off the ground with this project  <GRIN> I'll run probably no#4 cable from the Battery to the line of cells on both the Neg and Positive sides... (an alternate to that is using Arc welder cable leads) but as long as they can handle 250~275Amps continiously I don't care what the cables are.
 from here it depends on what I find in the operation of the truck goes like
 I believe 8 cells with 2LPM each will make my engine run at 3000+RPM no load so obviously I will have to throttle it...
  I "SHOULD" be able to use the throttle body on the intake manifold to control the Volume of Hydroxy gas and have it controled by the throttle like normal... this is one of the big UNKNOWNS that I will have to figure out as I do it.
 I may be able to block off all outside air and just feed the intake with the 1/2" hose
(it will probably be sucked flat!) but only time will tell on that.
...
Next will probably come a Small storage container for the HHO and pressure switches to turn off cells when not needed...this may or may not come into play at this stage in time as I may make it first so I can control the cells automatically.
...
my goal is not to make enough Hydroxy gas to have the engine reach top RPM just 3000 to 3500RPM is more than enough for me . so there is a possibility that I might run out of gas while pulling a long hill or carrying a load or both...
....
I plan on starting the truck on gasoline and then turning off a switch installed in the fuel line going to the injectors, once its running on HHO... this may or may not be necessary
or even feasible if I have to cap off all outside air going to the engine... if that's the case then I'll just cap the fuel line for the time being. and start it on HHO alone.
...
thats the plan
 got any comments ?
fire away !
...
Bob...


 

[crb]

Bob,
What ever happened to running your B&S engine on hho?
crb

[randy]

I've thought about running on hho exclusively myself, here's my thoughts, eliminate intake manifold, just flat plate with a 1/2" hose barb for each cylinder is needed, hoses connect to a gate valve manifold, other side of gate valve goes directly to bubblers, each cylinder line and bubbler output has flashback protection, inline with bubblers is a low capacity boost storage, an ecu would need to be developed for controlling output of the cells, the actuator for the gate valve would also control the ecu, a spring loaded ball check valve with a filtered inlet would be connected to the inlet side of gate valve also, this would prevent the "suck flat" problem, and allow extra air intake if needed, when starting the gate valve would have to have a total seal, once the boost storage is up to pressure the engine is turned over then the gate valve opened to prevent charging the exhaust system with hho before startup,"this would be a bad thing". the best thing for the boost storage that comes to mind would be a hot water bottle, rubber enema type,hahaha make a surrounding container larger then the bottle, the bottle would inflate like a balloon, if a flashback occurred it would just pop like a balloon and not send shrapnel flying "hopefully"

[Bob]

CRB:
mainly I could not change the spark far enough retarded to get the engine to run....
all it wanted to do was fire, spin the engine backwards and pop the safty cap on the generator
...( didn't have a bubbler on it at that time, just a pop off cap on the generator)
...even though I had more than enough HHO to run the engine  I could not get the timing close enough to TDC in order for it to run...the closest I could get the B&S engines was about 8deg advanced (5hp) and about 12deg on the 8hp...  I needed about -2 to -5 deg ATDC in order for it to run...
  so i simply gave up on it for the time being... I didn't want to have to re invent the wheel to test the theory ! LOL
...
Bob....

[Bob]

Randy...
 I like the idea of the Innima bag for the Acculumator tank HAHAHA  may look funny but I bet it would work slick !
...
 Gate Valve ? interesting thought !  but all the gate valves I know of had like 3" of threads you had to screw in to get the valve to close... or open bunches of turns...
now that I think of it I saw a gate valve on a sewer-tank truck that just had a lever that pushed the plate back and forth... hummmm great idea that !
...
a single large ball valve (brass so you can adjust its tightness on the inside) would make the on off movement in 90 degrees....
...
 your "Suck-flat Preventer" could be just a filtered check valve... a large "foot-valve"
or something like that...
...
 personally I like the idea of high vacuum in the engine as long as its not too strong,
max vacuum is -20psi and I suspect it would reach that and stay there with the outside air plated off.... but vacuum acts like a Spring just like small pressure does.... it would push or SUCK the pistons up instead of having to be Pushed by the crank ... just the oppisit of normal ware and tare. open a valve and the Hydroxy gas would Rush in ...almost turbo-charged because of the vacuum ! ... so don't fight the vacuum....use it to your advantage! HAHAHAHAHHAHA
...
Bob...

[crb]

A 2" hole, gate valve, or butterfly valve will pass approximatly 300 cfm.
crb

[Bob]

I drew up a basic diagram for my 10 cell unit for 100% hydroxy on the truck
 it will take a Minimum of 200amps to run it correctly and get out the 20LPM for near full throttle operation of the truck
...
 this does not show how I will control the cells when I am Not using all the Gas being generated however.... its just the starting point
...
...
 here's the picture
Bob...
 

[Bob]

 I think what I will do is have a few cells that are on constantly and 1 or 2 stages that kick-in as the demand for HHO goes up.
 to arrange this I will need a few more relays controled by pressure switches, these Relays will control the power to the cells... in parallel with the line coming off the first relay
so I will probably have 3 groups of cells
which may be as follows...
4 cells for Idling and slow speed
3 cells for medium speed that kick in to assist the 4 starting cells
3 cells for the high speed that kick in to add to all the others
...
a Small pressure pot out of 4" ABS or PVC pipe with a 2" pop off cap for the pressure tank
this tank will have a pressure gauge on it and 2 pressure switches one set at 5~7psi the other set to 7~10 psi... that is to say when the pressure drops below 8psi the first set of 3 cells will kick on
in addition to the 4 starting cells that are already on.... when pressure drops below 6psi the 2nd set of 3 cells will kick in to the already running 7 other cells making all 10 cells being on .
as soon as the pressure comes back up to 6~7psi the 3 cells will Kick out leaving  the system running on just 7 cells  as the pressure continues to gain to 8~9 psi the other set of 3 cells will be switched off leaving only the 4 starter cells running the truck....
 I expect that the 4 starter cells will not be able to sustain the running truck very long by them selves  so that the 1st set of 3 cells will be turning on and off most of the time.
  Ideally I'd like to have an amp gauge on the dash for each set of cells , as well as a pressure gauge on the dash for the pressure pot.
a manual switch for each set of cells on the dash as well to give me extra control over the system
...
 I'll draw up a diagram for how I have it envisioned  so you guys can help me trouble shoot any problems before I build it <HEHEHEHHE> 
...
Bob...

[Bob]

heres a drawing of the Imagined setup...
it has 3 sets of 4 cells making a total of 12 cells instead of 10 but the idea is exactly the same
... I plan on injecting the HHO right before the throttle body on the intake manifold  and using the throttle body to control speed like normal.... this may work and it may not... all I can do is try it and see !
...
Bob...

[Bob]

 I just saw a problem with my drawing... it simply won't work unless I put a ball valvebetween the pressure pot and the bubbler because all the pressure made will just go out through the bubbler and never switch off the 2 sets of generators because no pressure will build up... I have to have a ball valve there... so it will have to be my throttle or linked with the throttle
...
Bob.......

[H²+O]

wondering if you could do something like this to save space? because that would be alot of abs pipe! something i was thinking is that the bubbles that come off the plates are super small, but  they form big bubbles that splash water and E/lite getting it in the line and then into the engine (which hasn't really been a problem as of yet for anyone). heat is the only problem i see form that...

taking a piece of ABS pipe, lets say 3" for that amount of gas, and then taking another piece of 3" cutting out strip all the way down it so it fits snug in the main bubbler. Then take some fine ss screen and cut the inner pipe every 1" or so so it filters out the bubbles and gives it much less splash.

me and my bro are buying a 78 volvo 240 DL (gas carbed, not diesel) with a SU Carb on it. he wants to test the hho on it so i'm ordering parts for 4 randy cells, with 2" washers. something i was wanting to do was (like in another thread) put a amp limiter to each cell, so each cell can only draw 20-25 amps MAX.

steve

[Manta]

Bob,

... I may be able to block off all outside air and just feed the intake with the 1/2" hose...

I can't see this part of the plan working.
The sheer volume of air that is sucked into the engine will collapse your system and try to pull it all into the bores.
Maybe some kind is spring -loaded flap that comes in when required will help.  I dunno though.

Randy, what do you think ?

Dave
(Manta)

[randy]

Yeah, It's gonna need some kind of air inlet valve.

[Bob]

Yah I agree !
  looks to me like if I am going to use a small pressure tank then I have to have a ball valve linked to the Throttle body in order to get it to work... and if that's the case then Normal outside air can be let in through the air-cleaner like normal...
so I'll revise the drawing and see what it looks like.
...
Thank you for the INPUT !
...
Bob....

[Bob]

OK same drawing with a few changes...
 Planning now on normal intake setup (not blocked off)
feed of HHO to just in front of throttle body... that FEED is controled by a 1/2"~3/4" brass ball valve straight from the bubblers...
that ball valve will have to be linked to the throttle linkage to act as the accelerator... opening as the throttle valve opens... this means it will have to be adjustable in order to get the correct air/HHO mix as the throttle opens i.e. 1/4 throttle may mean 1/8 opening on the ball valve, 1/2 throttle may mean 3/4 open on the ball valve... no way to tell without testing but it is a certainty that adjustment will be needed.
....
starting on gasoline with the HHO system all off... once running turning on the HHO
soon as the pressure starts coming up turn off the gasoline by a toggle switch connected to an electric on off valve on the injector gas feed.
then your running on HHO and should run like normal operation.
it would be wise to turn back on the gasoline before shutting down the HHO to purge the system
and make it runnable on gasoline again for the next start... then kill it
...
here's the pic.
..
Bob.....