possible wireing error on my part?

[KF-Puffin1]

OK...Since i made that clamsheel design out of wall plates and fell in love with it for the time being.i decided to buy a bunch of them and create a few for wireing in series........simple thinking was i get a average of 1 lpm from one 3 plate cell @ 15-18 amps..... i should be able to get 6 lpm out of 6 of these cells wired in series @ 15-18 amps..........but "NOPE".  only getting around 2.5 lpm total...sigh...

so i need someone with a better grasp on electrical current to explain why this did not work so well for me.

one single cell pumps out some serious bubbles...when i added all the cells together it looked like it cut the prodution of each cell in half.....they all look to be putting out equal amounts of gas,but just not near as much as they could.

some help please

[randy]

add more electrolyte, bring them amps up.

[hydrotinkerer]

Make sure you have 13+ volt applied. Like Randy said add electrolite bring those amps up.

[candyman55]

how about a couple of pictures?

[KF-Puffin1]

i was trying to maintain around the 15-18 amps total .i had for the first cell........do you think it would need more amps total to run all 6 of em at the same level as the single cell at 15 amps?

for some reason ^^^^that^^^^^^ just dont seem like i worded ^^^^^that^^^^ correctly lol

I'll get the pic's on here real soon.

the way i have them runing is this.......  3 total , 3 inch wide pvc chambers, 15 inch tall each....2- 3 plate cells in each chamber. 

[geezer]

built a couple of so called clam shells awhile back thought it was a good way to control stray current used KOH didnt think to much of it so went on to other things. after reading comments on it thought i would play a little. took three sw`. plates -+-  about .030 spaceing droped it in some week old koolaid about 8 packs 1/2 gal. shop temp about 68 started at 18amps lots of fomey bubbles 30 min lots of action see black things floating around ck temp. 175 ck amps 35 breaker kicks so un plug. pos. plate very black and scaley.  now for the rest of the story.  finished putting a clam shell together skimed the black chunks off the top didnt know you could cook koolaid ,things cooled down 105 degs.  droped it in 16 amps 2 hrs later 22amps 130 degs. lots of good bubbles maybe 1/2LPM not good for that amps so turn it off ,still bubbleing ,unhook wires still bubbleing ,not as fast. 15min later temp 120 1/2 in.bubble one per sec. still some foamy stuff ,anouther 15 min temp 108 lots of pin head sized bubbles 5min more temp 104 and it stoped. try it again tommorrow and try to keep temp up seewhat happins

[KF-Puffin1]

way i have em is (+ - +)....i get no bubbles at all from my outside plates everything  bubbles inside and comes out one hole.on one upper side of plate.

last night i also epoxy'd the gap between plates closed on the top of plates where they come together.and about 1/2 inch down top sides.

[Bob]

Good Work KF !
sounds like you got something to work with now !  KOOL !
...
Yes I ran into the same problem running my 3 Randy cells and it goes along with All cells in series
although the amprage is NOT supposed to change , and Logic tells you the output should double it certainly doesn't !....
Just like I was trying to explain before in another thred  but I got it all confuzelated....
when you add another cell of the same type in series with the original cell both cells will drop in half of their production, giveing you the same output as you had with just one cell...
weird but thats the way it works... because the AMPRAGE is devided among those 2 cells ...
sense the amprage is Devided by 2 the output is also... so that explains the results of same LPM output for 2 cells as opposed to one...
but it gets realy nasty when you take it one step further and add a 3rd cell and the output drops to 1/4 the original ! ( as near as I could tell anyway) .... logically thinking the output should drop to 1/3... because the amprage is devided among the 3 cells instead of one ...
so the answer is simple... if you put 3 cells in series you need to pump in 3 times the 15 amps you did on the first cell to achieve 3 times the production....or 45 amps for 3 cells and you should recieve the 1LPM per cell or 3LPM.... 3LPM for 45 amps ain't that bad at all actually !
.....
I found that my Randy cells worked the same way but I didn't have (and still don't ) the amprage to give them 20 amps per cell or 60amps... so I disconnected one cell ( the center one) and hooked them in parallel (which is diferent than series, make no mistake there!) and feed them with 30 amps
the output is improved and I expect I am getting close to 3.5 to 3.75LPM at 30amps warmed up...
not too bad...if the plates stay clean ! ...
....
this seams to be a big stumbleing block to most people, I know it was for me it took me a week to figure out why it did what it did.....
...
I think it was Candyman that explained it with the Headlight example and it realy explains it well.
a Hydroxy Cell is allot like a headlight but the brightness is traded off for Hydroxy gas is all
both are Reactive loads, meaning the more power you pump into the thing the more they produce!
( light or gas)...
so in this configuration where you have 3 cells in series the voltage is devided and so is the Amprage......
this is easy to see if you look at each cell as a unit the cells will take only as much amprage as is available and devide it evenly between all 3 cells... same thing with the Voltage
... to prove this you could put a amp meter between the center cell and the next cell on the pos lead...
...
this is something that goes against teachings in electronics from what I understand...but then again maybe not...<GRIN> all I know is what I discovered...
and that is if you hook 2 cells in series, and you keep the voltage and amps the same the output stays exactly the same... you add a 3rd cell and the output drops way down !
...the only cure I know of is more amprage... if you want more LPM it takes MORE AMPS ! theirs no free lunch !
...
Geezer:
 isn't the connection to the clamshell supposed to be +-+ not the other way around ?
it may make a big diference in the production, I dunno !
...

Bob..........


 

[geezer]

Bob I'm old &slow typer use the HP&BS system thats hunt peck & backspace. so dont use any more words than necessary dont spell to good so some times have to find a way around words cant spell. what i was trying to say was to do a comparison between two types. I started with three plates looking in same direction. Then changed to clamshell same koolaid same power supply to see difference. when unhooked clam the crazy thing kept on making good bubbles for over 30 min.

[geezer]

well i checked the clam at 130 deg. with it un hooked showed 1.22 volts across term. pulled it out and there it was. looks like i used plated nuts one was half gone. guess i made a cheap battery useing different metals and koolaid with the temp. was enough to make bubbles.

[Bob]

Yep that explains that ! HEHEHEHEH
....
good deduction Geezer!

Bob......