2 liters a minute at 5 amps?

[b1jetmech]

Hello all,

I found this on Ebay and do you know how they did 2 LPM at 5 amps? I'd say that's revolutionary.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/The-Most-Efficient-Hydrogen-HHO-Generator-On-The-Market_W0QQitemZ260370181240QQihZ016QQcategoryZ46093QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[janmarsh]

Sodium Hydroxide as electrolyte.............Interesting !!!    Need to look at the cell design of that one.        I,ve sent for a full test report & lab details.

Cleaned once every six months?       I think the customer will have to replace his engine once every six months.

           Wait for the feedback.   I fear we are about to see a very pissed off customer.

[b1jetmech]

The cell design itself, I wonder if they have it wired in series.

Using Sodium Hydroxide I wonder how that measures up to KOH?

Chase

[mileageseeker]

  They got 2.13 LPM at 73.14 watts in their dreams. 29.12 mmw, come on, get real!! I don't know about you guys, but I'm getting tired of people making ridiculous, absurd, stupid claims. They says (lab tested and certified) I wonder if they would supply the name and phone number of the lab?
  About sodium hydroxide, it's being used by some experimenters but because it goes out of solution they all use two bubblers to clean the gas before sending it to the engine. Get some lye, mix up a little batch and hang a piece of aluminum in it. What you see happening would be going on inside your engine if the gas isn't scrubbed clean. Most say, better to stick with potassium hydroxide, and always use a bubbler.

[Manta]

Voltag        Elapsed Time       Temperature         HHO LPM               Amps
12.0 V           20 min                141 F                   1.73                 4.5
13.0 V           40 min                147 F                   1.82                 4.8
13.5 V           60 min                150 F                   1.98                 5.0
13.8 V           80 min                156 F                   2.13                 5.3


Now that's different.  Notice that as the amp draw increases,  the voltage also increases.  It's normal for the voltage to drop as the amps increase.  although at that small current I would expect the voltage regulator to hold it pretty constant.

Manta

[janmarsh]

Got this back from them.   This unit is giving 400% output compared to a cell considered a good performer.   Too good to be true ?  

You must ask yourself why this official copy of performance is not shown on ebay ?  Sorry to sound cynical.

[b1jetmech]

Okay, Now I'm really confused into how he did it.

My best guess is there are two cells that are in series which could explain the low amp draw. Did he measure the H2 output with an actual flow meter? 

[Manta]

They say that the high output and low current was probably down to the way the plates were connected.  The say that they didn't have any plans and thus don't know how the connections went.  Not very scientific.

Manta

[Painless]

To quote the document:

"In conjunction we measured the temperature of the exterieor of the generator"

They recorded exterior temps in the range of 141 to 156 F, with these kind of temperatures reaching the outside of the PVC, it is my experience that much higher temps are evident inside.  The generator is a water boiler and the majority of the 'huge' output is steam vapour.

If you want to buy one, simply drain the system and fill it with fresh tap water, drop in a couple of teabags, wait about 10 minutes then drain it into a mug containing milk and sugar.  I'm sure it will be quite refreshing!

One lump or two?

Russ.

[janmarsh]

You would assume such things are understood by The Assistant Dean Of Science.  That would be criminal of a university to overlook such things.

[mileageseeker]

I'm fighting the temptation to ask him if he offers a money back guarantee. If so, then actually buy one so I can put it on the flow bench to see what it really does. As Painless says, we know it'll certainly brew a cup of tea. 

[b1jetmech]

Well, 2 LPM on 5 amps is revolutionary. Someone buy one and try it out...and get back to us

[Bob]

Well, the best output I have ever seen to date is n the "Randy Cell" and under the careful construction of Randy that little cell can out preform anything I have seen to date ! ... but Reproducing it to get that much output is very difficult... if I remember right Randy got 1.5LPM at 10amps with a single "Randy cell"... but I have never achieved that much... he is simply better at making one than I am <GRIN>
and if you think about it it probably is possible to achieve 2LPM at 10amps but I sure don't know HOW it could be done... but as for that guys claim... I'ed say Hog wash!
and without very spific info on how he measured it , and what kind of power he was using I would say its just nonsense....and that it can't be done!
something is giving him a false reading...but you'ed think a guy would double check those things before making such statements... but try to keep an open mind... it is POSSABLE simply because anything is possable in this world ! but at the same time its Highly unlikely!
...thats like getting 21LPM out of the old JOE cell....  come on !  you'ed be lucky to get 2LPM out of it at 30amps ...how in blazes are you going to get 21 LPM ?   by not regulateing the power and pluging it directly into the battery and let it go into thermal run away.... thats how!  is that the proccess that this guy gets his high output ?  I'ed say more than likely !
...
if its a comercial unit and it used Sodium Hydroxide I quit looking at that point ! <GRIN> sodium Hydroxide is bad news in Hydroxy gas production !
....
so maybe there is something about letting a cell go into thermal runaway ? besides the boiling of the electrolyte... perhaps when a cell is in thermal runaway it produces large amounts of Hydroxy gas
if allot of that happends to be water vapor  just run it through a condencer and get it back
maybe thermal runaway is a good thing? we have been fighting trying to stay away from thermal runaway
but has anyone tested a cell much that does go into thermal runaway ? I doubt it !
... perhaps that a piece of the puzzel ...who knows!
...
Bob.......

[Painless]

Bob,

When a cell goes into thermal runaway, even if we put the steam vapour to one side for the moment, consider how much the gas will expand due to heat. When we measure HHO we are measuring volume displacement. When you heat a volume of any gas, the warmer it gets the more volume it occupies.

Russ.

[janmarsh]

Q:  WOW thats 34 MMW Your 2 LMP @ 5 amp claim seems to good to be true. 2 LPM @ 5amps is actualy "over unity" IF the internals are something other than stainless steal, that might exlpain your super high output Mar-23-09
A:   Your assumptions may or may not be correct. There are a lot of "Exotic" materials out there. That is all I am willing to say. 
Q:  how would this unit work on a 3 cyl. kubota diesel? Mar-23-09
A:   It would work very well on either the TLB series or the Mx series. One is naturally aspirated, the other supercharged. The setting on the EFIE unit would be extremely important. The installation instructions would be different on the supercharged model. In addition to saving fuel, you would have a noticeable gain in power. If you decide you want to purchase one please inform us at the time if your unit is supercharged.
Q:  I have a few Qestions what does "Sodium Hydroxide" do ?? Will this unit make 2 liters per min. using only distilled water only ?? If not how much will it make using distilled water ONLY ?? You said it needs to be cleaned every 6 months, what happens if it doesn't get cleaned out?? Also where can I buy the stuff to add in with the water?? Also how much does it cost ?? have you ever put 2 or 3 of these on one car?? if so did it make any diff. ?? Thank You Mar-17-09
A:   1. Sodium Hydroxide (more common name) Lye. when mixed with water forms an electrolyte. similar to the acid used in your car battery to create an electrolyte or electrolytic solution. 2. No. Just as your car battery will not produce 12 volts on pure water neither will this generator. We have never paid for test results of water only, since water only is contrary to the design principal of this unit. Remember our objective was to attain the highest output with the lowest amperage draw, with physical size or the unit paramount, which is not attainable with distilled water alone. If it like every other generator on the market is not cleaned as needed (6months is a ball park figure it really depends on the amount of driving you do, could be once per year. There will form a residue on the stainless steel plates and it will loose HHO output. (relate it to changing the oil in your car, or cleaning your fuel injectors) You never need to replenish the sodium hydroxide. You re-use your old filtered solution. If you want to buy the highest grade possible like we use it is available from essentialsolutions.com. The cost around $10.00 for 2 pounds. No we have not found the need for more than one unit per vehicle. Our unit puts out more than twice the amount of hho (lab tested and certified)as the average unit advertised on ebay. This is off the record, but just to inform you, we built a new experimental unit yesterday. It bench tests better than anything we have ever built. We will be installing it on a test vehicle today. It is scheduled in The university Science Lab for testing input voltage, operating temperature, Liters per minute, and amperage draw. At various voltage inputs. We are hoping for a 25% to 50% gain over our current model. Down side is it will be more costly to produce.
Q:  does this unit ever need to be cleaned out.if so how? i cant afford much do you sell unassembled kits for less? Mar-10-09
A:   Yes we recommend cleaning every six months. Empty the contents into a container and save. Fill the unit with water & Vinegar and shake. Discard the vinegar water. Filter your old solution through a coffee filter & replace. No we do not sell in kit form. Our design is one that we do not want to share. Our unit is so unique that I do not want anyone trying to copy it. I am sorry but I spent over 2 years to come up with this unit, and find low amperage draw and extremely high output. You can buy a unit quite similar to this with a few extra frills with a one liter output in kit form from eagle-research.com The kit price is $388.00 plus 10% more for shipping. Thanks for your interest. Darol Darol Mason
 
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