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Painless
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« on: January 16, 2009, 05:33:03 pm » |
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Those that know me from hhoforums.com will know that I am in the habit of sharing my whole adventures, good and bad, when it comes to HHO. Here's a summary of where I've been so far: I've been building my own design of dry cell, based on Lowes switchplate covers and other readily available Lowes parts, my last creation had 25 plates and produced 2.33 LPM of HHO at about 110 F. MMW was about 6.3 with a PWM. The issue I've been having with my Dodge Ram (4.7 L) is that I haven't yet been able to produce enough HHO to make it even blink. Based on research I'm now shooting for 4 LPM upwards. And so, I've abandoned the switch plate covers for some proper laser cut SS plates and build what I call my 'Monster Cell' (actually named by another forum member from his reaction to this photo):  Here's the reservoir I've built for this cell from 12" long, 3" wide PVC pipe:  The new cell has 49 plates and is built in a 5 neutral configuration. At the moment it's ticking over gently on a 12v power supply but I'm hoping to give it a try in the truck over the weekend. My fingers are crossed for 4+ LPM at 45-50 amps! Russ. |
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hg2
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« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2009, 09:31:12 pm » |
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Great looking dry cell build Russ.What size plates and spacing did you use?Also is the 5 neutral setup you mentioned configured +nnnnn- (I didn't use use all 49 for the example too much typing haha)?
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Painless
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« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2009, 09:51:39 pm » |
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Yup, the configuration is +NNNNN-, I did test 6 neutrals but just couldn't pull more than 20 amps, even on the alternator. The gaskets are 0.040" thick (1/24"). As for the size of the plates, they are approximately 5"x3" made from 304L stainless.
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hg2
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« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2009, 10:48:03 pm » |
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Yeah I never could get much production with a 7 cell configuration 6 seems to work best and the jury is still out on 5 cells,I still believe with 5 cells your making more steam than quality hydroxy with only 4 neutrals.I must say that 1/24" spacing is the closest I've ever heard anyone going with.Do you think that's enough space for the bubbles to move freely enough through?Well as they say the proofs in the puddin(or the carrots heheheh),you'll see once you have it installed on the vehicle and running max voltage through it.Btw did you use flat spacers or o-rings?
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Bob
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« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2009, 12:17:11 am » |
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VERY Nice Painless !
I see no truble for the 1/24" spaceing myself as the Randy cells work fantastic on less spaceing than that... ( those hydroxy bubbles are very very small indeed!)
...
Looks like it should work great for you ! plan on 2 of them however ! <GRIN>
Remember Hydrotech's 8LPM and 74MPG on his big truck ?
that took him 3 cells in series to do that but he did accomplish it !
in this case 2 or 3 in parallel should get you what you need...
I think your headding in the right direction... you just need MORE !
hehehehe
...
Bob.......
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"Mother always told me "Son the Imposable is only a little bit harder"...and You know ... She WAS RIGHT!"
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Painless
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« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2009, 08:41:12 pm » |
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I know what you mean bob. This cell has twice the number of plates plus each plate is about 30% bigger than the old ones. I've been using the shower pan liner gaskets for a while, so expect good results with those.
I'm expecting about 4 LPM from this cell and am going to compliment it with home made water injection once I'm satisfied its working well enough.
I've followed the work of another youtuber with the same year, model and engine truck and he got about 30% improvement at 3.5 LPM. All he did though was install o2 extenders, I'm going a lot further than that with home designed and built MAP, IAT and O2 modifying circuits.
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Bob
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« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2009, 02:30:08 am » |
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Honnestly I think the O2 extenders just make the computers automatic adjustment a bit less!
I don't think its a cure by any means... its just a band-aid! so fixing it right the first time will save you lotsa greef in the long run !
...<grin>
Bob.......
( but I do sware by that Matt Valve!)
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"Mother always told me "Son the Imposable is only a little bit harder"...and You know ... She WAS RIGHT!"
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hg2
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« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2009, 07:42:41 am » |
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Russ where do you buy the pop off plugs shown on your bubbler?
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crb
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« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2009, 10:13:02 am » |
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I've seen those plugs at lowes.
crb
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Painless
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« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2009, 11:39:26 am » |
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They are in the plumbing section at Lowes.
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Painless
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« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2009, 09:54:31 pm » |
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Well, I did some flow tests today and got 4 LPM at about 40 odd amps. The engine note changed when I connected the HHO hose, so I'm fairly confident that its having an effect. I plan to fill up tomorrow and see what happens without any mods at first.
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Bob
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« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2009, 10:54:14 pm » |
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WOOO HOOO thats good output Painless ! I bet it will help allot
although you may not gain any MPG without any other mods but I expect you WILL Notice the power increase.... I did with only 2.5LPM on my 2.5Liter toyota R22...
...sure there is a huge diference in size but your getting in the ball park now and it should start to make a diference in that big monster truck !
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I wish ya Luck !
...
Bob.......
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"Mother always told me "Son the Imposable is only a little bit harder"...and You know ... She WAS RIGHT!"
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Painless
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« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2009, 10:16:41 am » |
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Thanks Bob!
I've been at this for quite some time now, building bigger cells each time to increase output and still seeing no gains. This is the first time I've had any audible reaction from my engine. When I connected the hose, I heard the rpms rise slightly then fall as the ECU adjusted things.
I've always been fearful that some are seeing gains only through leaning and may be damaging their engines long term. I've purchased and installed an exhaust gas temperature gauge and established a good baseline of readings at different cruise speeds before HHO. This will be my safety guide before trying my home made MAP, IAT or O2 mod circuits.
Russ.
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hg2
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« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2009, 05:07:50 pm » |
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Russ where did you get your EGT gauge and how much are they?I'm still dialing in my Dodge and have also been fearful of going too high with the MV.
The way I've heard it from a few sources is that you don't want to exceed 180deg F(over the stock temp readings) when adjusting the O2 efie.Have you seen the same or other when researching the use of efies with EGT gauges?
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« Last Edit: January 20, 2009, 05:15:27 pm by hg2 »
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Painless
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« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2009, 08:13:31 pm » |
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This is the gauge I use: http://www.glowshiftdirect.com/elite-7-color-2200-exhaust-gas-temperature-egt-pyrometer.aspxNot a bad deal on price and the install is fairly easy, the only tough part is drilling and tapping the exhaust manifold. I ended up installing mine around the same area as the oxygen sensor as the manifold was very slim and other areas were hard to get to with a drill. I took some baselines from my Ram stock: Idle: 700 F 30 mph: 900 F 40 mph: 950 F 50 mph: 1,000 F 55 mph: 1,100 F For a full throttle run from standstill to 70 mph, its passing 1,500 F when I hit the brakes. So far, it seems to be running a little cooler (about 100 F, if that) with the new cell on, I haven't started on tuning electronics yet though. I want to take it one step at a time and monitor results, I have an ELM327 OBD interface to my laptop and am collecting data at each stage. |
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